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Business and Startups

Place to discuss anything and everything about business and startups. From economics, to investments to startup gossip, to technology et al.

Rohit pande , Have a view on many things but happy to thras Oct, 28 2016

Is this a Desi Tesla or yet another PR pitch ?


Electric vehicles is one of the first things which come to mind when one thinks large scale disruption in the coming future. A great place to have a story, but are we talking about real innovation here or would one be importing SKD's from Shenzhen. Not that marketing is not an innovation itself, but it comes back to the same thing then - raising more and more money and capturing mindspace. Either ways, its good for the environment if this can be mainstreamed and made practical


Ather Energy finds its Hero with Rs 205 crore - The Economic Times

Electric vehicles is one of the first things which come to mind when one thinks large scale disruption in the coming future. A great place to have a story, but are we talking about real innovation here or would one be importing SKD's from Shenzhen. Not that marketing is not an innovation itself, but it comes back to the same thing then - raising more and more money and capturing mindspace. Either ways, its good for the environment if this can be mainstreamed and made practicalAther Energy finds its Hero with Rs 205 crore - The Economic Times

Abhishek Sharma , Dreamer, Mechanical engineer @ BITS Pilani Oct, 28 2016


It is not a PR pitch, I have worked with them as an intern, these guys are onto something, have amazing mentors as Bansals.

Hero will not put in 200 crore on a simple PR, there needs to be some value for Hero to put in this money. Hero hasn't just raised funds, they have hard earned their money so they would bet only on things that will produce money for them

It is not a PR pitch, I have worked with them as an intern, these guys are onto something, have amazing mentors as Bansals. Hero will not put in 200 crore on a simple PR, there needs to be some value for Hero to put in this money. Hero hasn't just raised funds, they have hard earned their money so t


Nilesh Pathak , Pursuing MS, CMU Oct, 28 2016


But the desi Tesla was Mahindra Reva, much ahead of the time and a perfect product. Mahindra E20 could have done wonders if it was supported by PR.

Tesla would look exactly like E20 when it will come to India, is my hunch but it will be welcomed and celebrated unlike E20



Rohit pande , Have a view on many things but happy to thras Oct, 28 2016


True, but it still doesn't look like the right time for India yet. or is it now right ? charging stations et al.


Abhishek Sharma , Dreamer, Mechanical engineer @ BITS Pilani Oct, 28 2016


Even in USA charging stations didn't come before Tesla. So I believe its perfectly the right time.


Nilesh Pathak , Pursuing MS, CMU Oct, 28 2016


E20 did not reach the point where it could have been rejected because of lack of its charging capacity, it was rejected much earlier. Though it had a strong presence in Bangalore because of awareness of people, it failed PR driven by hero like value.

To an extent I find the same with Awaremonk as well, it must have been adopted by various celebrities if it was made in silicon valley. This hit me hard since I have come to CMU, that Indians are using products just because it was used outside than the real value of it.

E20 did not reach the point where it could have been rejected because of lack of its charging capacity, it was rejected much earlier. Though it had a strong presence in Bangalore because of awareness of people, it failed PR driven by hero like value.To an extent I find the same with Awaremonk as wel


Abhishek Sharma , Dreamer, Mechanical engineer @ BITS Pilani Oct, 28 2016


Flipkart Snapdeal Ola, earlier, MMT, Justdial etc have been adopted by Indians


Rohit pande , Have a view on many things but happy to thras Oct, 28 2016


But thats the whole point. Even without intrinsic value as long as there is a strong PR balloon, one can spread ideas with huge losses in one's books in the short run. Its when time passes that the test of value is to be passed against tech innovation as well as business model innovation. Justdial may just be flunking that test even as we talk.
But thats the whole point. Even without intrinsic value as long as there is a strong PR balloon, one can spread ideas with huge losses in one's books in the short run. Its when time passes that the test of value is to be passed against tech innovation as well as business model innovation. Justdial m


Abhishek Sharma , Dreamer, Mechanical engineer @ BITS Pilani Oct, 28 2016


But the companies I mentioned have/had intrinsic value. Justdial might be flunking now but i remember how 5-6 years ago I used it many times. Just dialing the nos. and getting all the information.

They have failed to keep up with the disruption.



Rohit pande , Have a view on many things but happy to thras Oct, 28 2016


We need to define "intrinsic value " for this discussion. It should get reflected in either current profit or an asset for future profit. Its an open debate for the Indian startup ecosystem whether these companies which are currently showing huge losses are actually building that storehouse for future monetization or would they go the just dial way as tech giants like google/ Facebook/ amazon expand their service offerings. But thats another debate. If flipkart is great, then Ather Energy is surely cool ( if for nothing else, then for raising multiple capital rounds ), the moot question is that even if FK is not so great, is Ather Energy still different and valuable ?
We need to define "intrinsic value " for this discussion. It should get reflected in either current profit or an asset for future profit. Its an open debate for the Indian startup ecosystem whether these companies which are currently showing huge losses are actually building that storehouse for futu


Abhishek Sharma , Dreamer, Mechanical engineer @ BITS Pilani Oct, 29 2016


Intrinsic value is also building an entire industry and sustaining for over a decade.mmt justdial even fk have defined or invented a whole industry in India.


Rohit pande , Have a view on many things but happy to thras Oct, 29 2016


1. You are right that the market and investors have given them about a decade of uninterrupted work in their respective segments with increasing losses

2. But to stretch it to say, this is intrinsic value can be misleading as given the oxygen of fresh funds, these businesses would collapse. Should this happen even after a decade of customer experiences is the moot question

1. You are right that the market and investors have given them about a decade of uninterrupted work in their respective segments with increasing losses2. But to stretch it to say, this is intrinsic value can be misleading as given the oxygen of fresh funds, these businesses would collapse. Should th


Rohit pande , Have a view on many things but happy to thras Oct, 28 2016


Yes, even selling a new green technology can be valuable from a company perspective even if there is no manufacturing innovation. The concern though is the ecosystem, are we ready for a roll-out in India ? No one company can influence the ecosystem to bring adoption.


Hero Point is well taken, Lala hard earned moolah. Given that there is no commercialization yet, is the valuation justified by the IP ?

Yes, even selling a new green technology can be valuable from a company perspective even if there is no manufacturing innovation. The concern though is the ecosystem, are we ready for a roll-out in India ? No one company can influence the ecosystem to bring adoption. Hero Point is well taken, Lala h


Abhishek Sharma , Dreamer, Mechanical engineer @ BITS Pilani Oct, 28 2016


What do you mean by "selling a new green technology can be valuable from a company perspective even if there is no manufacturing innovation. "


Rohit pande , Have a view on many things but happy to thras Oct, 28 2016


Means even if they finally import it as a SKD from China and are just able to build a marketing hype in order to sell and raise investments so that the initial adopters have a smooth experience. They would still be valuable in the short run


Nilesh Pathak , Pursuing MS, CMU Oct, 28 2016


They might have directly invested in manufacturing which is owned by them and used by Ather. Or in any other format as Hero has the capacity to offer value worth this much without really investing this much of cash.


Rohit pande , Have a view on many things but happy to thras Oct, 28 2016


Good for us to discuss basis the ET report, but one is better off taking published numbers with a pinch of salt. the great Indian rope trick is sometimes at work, a sleight of hand at the way numbers and valuations are presented and media is a willing accomplice, at times the conspirator to get a juicy headline
Good for us to discuss basis the ET report, but one is better off taking published numbers with a pinch of salt. the great Indian rope trick is sometimes at work, a sleight of hand at the way numbers and valuations are presented and media is a willing accomplice, at times the conspirator to get a ju


Nilesh Pathak , Pursuing MS, CMU Oct, 28 2016


My bad, will refer to the report.